Delusional
Every founder is called delusional before they're called successful.
The world has never been changed by people who thought realistically.
Every breakthrough, category-defining business and industry leader was once dismissed as too ambitious, too risky or completely delusional.
DELUSIONAL is where entrepreneurs, founders, creators and high performers come to challenge conventional thinking and hear the conversations most people never get access to.
Hosted by Sammy Kennedy, each episode goes beyond the highlight reel to uncover the decisions, failures, mindset and strategies behind people building extraordinary businesses and lives. From multi-million-dollar founders to industry disruptors, you'll discover what it really takes to create something that everyone else thought was impossible.
This isn't motivation.
It's the blueprint for thinking bigger, leading differently and building a life most people will never have the courage to pursue.
If people aren't questioning your vision...
You probably aren't thinking big enough.
New episodes every Monday.
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Delusional
Sacrificing Everything to Build a World-First Limoncello Brand with Solbevi
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He didn't pay himself for two years. He sold a house he didn't want to sell. His girlfriend covered rent, groceries, everything, while he worked night shifts in construction to keep his limoncello brand alive.
Today, Solbevi is on Qantas flights, at the F1, and in over a thousand stores across Australia. Stefan Di Benedetto joins me to talk about what it actually took to get there, the years nobody saw, the near-collapse over a batch of 20,000 cans, and the one thing his girlfriend said that changed everything.
This is one of the most honest conversations we've had on the show.
→ The two years he went without paying himself, and what it actually cost him and his girlfriend Amy
→ The moment he got emotional talking about it on camera for the first time
→ How a batch of 20,000 cans nearly sank the business before it even launched
→ The story behind landing Solbevi on Qantas first class, and later at the Australian F1 Grand Prix
→ Why he turned down early interest from a US sports team, and what he did instead
→ His honest take on cash flow, retail contracts, and why alcohol might be the hardest industry to build in
→ What's next for Solbevi, and the one buyer he's hoping eventually comes knocking
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If you have any questions about the episode, have a burning question you would like me to answer on the show, or want to join our movement of ambitious beauty leaders, connect with me and the rest of our incredible community on Instagram:
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You go, mate, we just served it on the plane for the first time and it flew. It sold out in seconds.
SPEAKER_00Stefan D Benedetto is the founder and director of Soul Bevy, Australia's first ever lemoncello spritz in a can. What have been some of the sacrifices that have had to go on behind the scenes to make that happen?
SPEAKER_02I'm losing my hair, which is not good. Stressed out of my mind and really tired at the moment. Didn't take an income for two years. Amy paid for my whole life for two years. I worked at my local pub on Sundays to pay rent. I worked night shift construction for sort of six months. I'd do Sol Beaver during the day, night shift construction management at night, and then get a couple of hours of sleep and do it again to bankroll the business during winter. Couldn't even buy a coffee. I had to sell a house, which I really didn't want to do. So yeah. I think a little bit emotional here thinking about this, yeah? Never really spoken about in this much detail. People think you're the richest person in the world and you have all this money. It's like, no, you are delusional, Lack.
SPEAKER_00Since launch, Sol Bevy has grown rapidly. The brand has picked up significant international recognition, including liquor of the year at the USA Spirit Ratings and an award at the International Wine and Spirit Competition in London. What is the plan? What is the strategy?
SPEAKER_02The dream is to obviously take it to the US because that's where dreams are made of, apparently. Hopefully, our dream buyer being Campari comes knocking in our door and says, Hey, we didn't have a little mancello.
SPEAKER_00I don't mean to pry, I just I genuinely am invested to go through what you guys both went through. Because it's not just you, it is her too, because she is holding everything together.
SPEAKER_02I had a ring that I just bought, which I saved up over 18 months from cash from shows. She's not gonna like me saying this, but she pulled me up one day, first time ever, and said, I can't do this anymore. Because I was never home and I was always working weekends and late nights, and that was when I really had that like wow moment. Um, I need to make a change.
SPEAKER_00Hello and welcome back to the delusional podcast. I'm your host, Sammy Kennedy. Today I'm joined by an incredible founder who I met at the AHA Expo. I was blown away by this brand. I had no idea who they were. Funnily enough, they were in my Instagram DMs, and now I have learned the whole story. And A, I'm in awe of what you've achieved. B, I think that your story and the level of scale that you've had in such a short period of time is a conversation that needs to be had for business owners who are currently going through it or have the vision to go through it because there's so much that people don't see behind the scenes of these incredible brands. Welcome to the show, Stefan. How are you feeling?
SPEAKER_02Thank you. Thank you for having me. Nice intro, actually, probably the best I've had. Um, I am good, I'm tired. I think we should all agree that flying from Melbourne to Perth does actually give you jet lag. I said that last time too. I'm so tired, been up since 1.30 technically here. So um I'm good. And what are you doing here in Perth? I'm here for another show for the Good Food and Wine Show. So this is a consumer one where we can sort of get people to try our product, they buy our product, and it helps with our brand awareness and eventually the sales in stores.
SPEAKER_00So yeah. Now, the one question that I ask every guest on this show is like every single founder is called delusional before they're called successful.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00What has been the biggest thing you've been called delusional for?
SPEAKER_02I think putting my career and starting a limoncello brand, because I think you gotta, if you take it back to five years, what are we now? Yeah, five years ago, when five to six years ago, when I had the idea, you know, Limoncello wasn't really a thing back then. It was an old product that sort of sat on the shelf. It's always been around. But in Australia, it sort of sat on the shelf maybe of one or two products, old sort of Italian branding, neglected, no one drank it. We would make it at home and we'd have it as Italians, but the general population here in Australia never really brought it. Um, so going from a Tier 1 construction background and having you know pretty decent wage at that age and a previous business which was doing pretty well in as well, to give it all up to create a Lumencello brand. People are like, what is wrong with you? Like, what is Lumencello? Who cares about Lumencello? So that was probably the biggest time I was called delusional, especially from my parents.
SPEAKER_00Oh yeah. And your parents aren't entrepreneurial, are they? They haven't owned a business, so you didn't have that, hey, I understand what it's like. It's like, what are you doing? Are you crazy?
SPEAKER_02Literally, not at all. They both had, you know, stable jobs, I guess. One was on minimum wage, still is, she's at the same company. And then dad worked for the ATO for 32 years, so uh public servant. So very, very different.
SPEAKER_00And do you have any siblings?
SPEAKER_02One brother, he's a nurse, polar opposites to me, very quiet, shy, dark hair, tall and skinny. So we had literally look like one of us uh adopted. But funnily enough, I take after my mum and my brother takes after my dad.
SPEAKER_00That's really interesting. One thing I love about your story is that you have really leaned into your roots of Italian culture. Lemoncello, when you were explaining it to me, it was something that you did with the family, and your whole concept of this brand came from a family recipe. Can you tell me a little bit more about what your experience was when you took that family recipe and had an innovative approach to the amount of alcohol content in it if it historically hasn't been done that way before?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I kind of wanted to. I mean, firstly, my biggest concern was my family and them getting upset about it. And then the second concern was, I guess, people that knew, or mostly Italians that knew what limoncello was, would be like, okay, why have you lowered the alcohol percentage? So I wanted to do it for, like I said, a bigger picture. Limoncello's been there the whole time. No one's really drank it because it is so strong and you have a shot after dinner and that's about it. But I wanted to make it lower, smoother, easier to drink so that people, like young people like ourselves, will drink more of it responsibly, of course. But the whole purpose was that they could mix it in cocktails and have it in other ways rather than just one shot after dinner, and that's it. I wanted to show the world that you can drink it in so many different ways and how versatile it is. Like we've got venues that marinate chicken in it, got people that make desserts with it, various cocktails, and that was the whole purpose of it.
SPEAKER_00I had a shot of it when I was at the expo.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that video almost got me in a lot of trouble, by the way. Sorry. Because I didn't do it, I didn't have it in the 15mm glass like I was meant to. I was just standing over the bar pouring it in your mouth at the end of the show. Um, I may have been a little bit intoxicated when I was doing that as well.
SPEAKER_00Off the clock, maybe.
SPEAKER_02Who knows? Before. Anyway.
SPEAKER_00Well, all things aside, it was epic. I really loved it. I've had a Lemoncello shot before of the, I guess the traditional one. I went to an Italian house and they had all the smoked uh salami and all the things hanging up, and then they pulled out, and I was like, what is this? And that was about four years ago. Now it's in Santuros, they've got all these trends. It's the latest craze. Like you jumped on that bandwagon just before it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but that was the thing. Like, I have we had the idea or we had the plan that it could be something big. Did I expect it to go the way it's gone? No, not to this extent. But I definitely knew that had so much potential and it could become something bigger than what it was. And but yeah, it's wild. Like it's one of the fastest growing categories in the major retailers. Every person's posting about it. It's had two, three years where it's been the drink of summer, which is just wild to think.
SPEAKER_00I'm just thinking about your drink. How did you come to the idea of putting it in a can? Because this is usually a shot, right? It's not ever been done in a can before.
SPEAKER_02No, no, that was and that was what I was getting to before. I guess we wanted to show how versatile it was. So, how can you show people that it's a product that can be drank daily, or not necessarily daily, but like, you know, more freely, I suppose, not just an after shot, um, after dinner shot. So a limoncello spritz in Italy I knew was quite big. We have family over there, so we knew, you know, historically they drink it all the time. But there was no like ready-to-drink format here. And it wasn't really on many cocktail lists, and Aperol spritz was huge, and that led the way, and that would they're the business or the brand that we're trying to become, I suppose, and follow their path. We don't want to take over them, we want to join them. So it's like, cool, how can we make lemon cello easy, ready to drink, light so that it's actually you know enjoyable on the spot, ready to go, put in a can. Apirol had the little bottles, but for us, glass bottles didn't really make sense because they're just you know dangerous, you can drop them, they break, it's glass. Can is like you can use it anywhere and everywhere. And we have a big RTD culture here in Australia, so it just made a lot of sense.
SPEAKER_00Yes, definitely. You don't go to a music festival or you don't necessarily go to a bar and pick up a glass bottle where there's so many safety risks associated with that.
SPEAKER_02And you get your 10 cents back. Yeah, well, we take the 10 cent cents and donate it to charity, thank you for, which is something I'm pretty proud of, but um, it's important.
SPEAKER_00So when it comes to having this concept of building the Lemoncello spritz in the way you did, and then you're making it at home, like tell us a story about how it all got started.
SPEAKER_02So, COVID for us back in Melbourne, as most people would know, was relentless. It was horrible. Weirdly, it was actually the fun, funnest two years of my life because I lived in a massive sharehouse with my best mates, was still getting paid good money and uh and got to have a lot of fun. But I was making lumoncello for them in the house because I had so much spare time. They didn't know what lumencello was, so they were trying to be like, oh, this is nice. But my best mate in particular, who had Italian heritage as well, he was he loved it. So we were the only two drinking it. Gave it to the girlfriends at the time, who are still uh girlfriends, now fiance and and wives. Um, and they found it too strong, so they were making lumoncello spruces, and that's where the idea sort of sparked like, you know, why are they Italian? They're Aussie.
SPEAKER_00Okay.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and that's like our target market or our focus was Australians. Because as you know, and you said your friend before, Italian household, they will make it. It's easy to make. Everyone's got their own family recipe, and everyone thinks theirs is better than everyone else's. It's just an Italian thing. So we're like, cool, target the Aussies. Like when even when we started selling it, it was don't go to Italian restaurants, go to big Aussie pubs, high volume, something that we can, you know, put something different on the menu for them and drive sales that way.
SPEAKER_00So would the Italian restaurants even want yours? Because they'd probably have that ego of like, no, we make the best one. We don't want to invite you in.
SPEAKER_02That's exactly what my thought was. And I I'm actually still weirdly a little bit too scared to go into Italian restaurants. Like, I really, really don't at all. Is it a fear of judgment? It's a fear of judgment, uh, fear of judgment, 100%. Because they do think theirs is better. And then when they see the lower alcohol, they're like, this is not limoncello. But then you but then yeah, honey. Then you get a lot though that are like, actually, this tastes amazing. But I'm just, and that's from a lot of Italians, and we've converted a lot of Italians, and we have heaps of Italian restaurants, big ones, famous ones. But it's just, I don't know, me personally have this little like even when we launched it, I was so nervous to launch it. The can I had no issues with, but the bottle, I was kind of like, I'm gonna be judged here by my my family and everyone else. But uh, you know what, it worked out for the best because that is why we've won so many awards. Like, we're one of the highest awarded Lumacella brands in the world now, which is crazy. We won two more on the weekend. Um congrats, thank you. We've got a platinum, which is top of ranking and consumer choice award and gold.
SPEAKER_00So, did you update in that in the bio?
SPEAKER_02Like, no, when you said like two awards, it's like we've got a lot more than that. But hey, no need to brag. Um, but even just in venues and like these good food and wine shows, this is why we do them every week, the relentless how many we do, because we get direct feedback from the customer, and everyone are like, we tried one over there, and it's way too strong. This is so much smoother, this is so much easier to drink. And it's just after like three years, it's given me the confidence that you know what? We actually do have a really good product. And the decision to lower an alcohol and make it the way that I've made it has actually been beneficial.
SPEAKER_00So you were 23 years old when you started this whole concept.
SPEAKER_02When I started, yeah, correct. When I started the whole process of how the f how do you put this into a can and how the how do you make this commercially? Like I was making it on the soda stream at home. Yeah. Um, back to your original question. Sorry, I know we not got sidetracked. But yeah, I was uh making it, you know, at home, two or three litres, and then making it on a soda stream to try to work out how to spritz it up and do this and do that, and yeah. Then you go from that to 20,000 litres, it's very, very big difference.
SPEAKER_00How did you do that? How do you go from, hey, I'm making this in my kitchen at home with a soda stream? Oh, this is cute too. I need full production cans, it needs to be sent out. Like that's a big bet on yourself as well.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I actually had that's funny you say that. I actually had someone call me yesterday asking for advice because they want to do the same thing. And um, I'm brutally honest with people these days with how difficult it can be and how much money you have to spend up front of them. The kind, I guess the risk you have to take. I do have a big risk appetite, luckily, and I had fortunately saved a fair bit of money, so I kind of backed myself. But um, it was just research, like it was during COVID, I didn't know anyone in the industry. I had one friend of a friend that I spoke to, and he said, Hey, speak to these guys. They are a canning facility. Yeah. And then you meet with them, and one thing led to another. So then I got introduced to like a food scientist, because obviously you need nutritional information, and then they introduce you to a copacker and a canning person, a designer, and it just naturally, over time you meet someone, you know, everyone passes on their recommendations. So we stuck with those suppliers for a fair while, actually. I'm very loyal. And then recently, as we've gotten bigger and times have gotten tougher in the world, okay, like we've got to find cost savings. So now I've branched out to different suppliers and everything. But yeah, just it was just literally the first person that recommended someone. I was just like, yep, you'll do. Bang, took the risk, made it. We had a big stuff up on the first can order. So because no one had made commercially on a commercial scale Lomoncello spritz in a can or spritz ready to ready to drink spritz. These guys thought that it had to be more yellow. So they decided to put food dye in my recipe without telling me 20,000 cans, right?
SPEAKER_00But you're drinking it, you don't even see it.
SPEAKER_02No, well, some people pour it out. So, but anyway, I got it. I get the cans, and yeah, I tried them like, yep, good, tastes good. And then someone poured it out like a couple of weeks later, and I was like, what is that? It looks like aeroplane jelly. And to this day, I shouldn't say this because I don't want people to look it up, but to this day, that first ever batch that went into Dan Murphy's, someone left a comment as a bad review saying it looks like aeroplane jelly, and I'll never ever forget it. I'll never ever forget it. Because it was because they put food die in our product, and I'm like, it's like anyway, it was a big debacle.
SPEAKER_00So what do you do in those situations? Do you get a refund and they remake it, or do they go suck that and you gotta deal with it?
SPEAKER_02They had the power essentially. They're just like, you're a little guy, screw you, like whatever. You don't have any leverage. No, I had no leverage, exactly. And I had to sell 20,000 cans pretty quickly to try and recoup my money. So I went down to all the damn Murphy stores. That stage it was nine, and by that time I got to sort of 30 stores, I went and bought back all my stock and then like paid for another production right up front and then put that one on the shelf instead. Then we used it as like samples and consumed it ourselves. So I basically threw out circa 15,000 cans. We didn't throw it in the bin, but we drank it ourselves and we sampled with it, and yeah, not ideal.
SPEAKER_00What was the biggest lesson that you learned in that whole process?
SPEAKER_02Uh, I needed more attention to detail. Like, you've got to be right into the detail and right into the thick of it. I do get too complacent and put a lot of trust in people, and I'll be like, yep, like you know what you're doing, you do this stuff every day. Not always the case. People make mistakes too, so you've just got to be on top of it, pay attention, and you know what, unfortunately, double check people's work.
SPEAKER_00Yes, definitely. And now that you have scaled this brand, what have been some of the sacrifices that have had to go on behind the scenes to make that happen? Like financially, relationship-wise, friends, family, stress levels or health?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, all the above. I'm losing my hair, which is not good. Stressed out of my mind and really tired at the moment. But um, actually, from a stress perspective, I'm actually in a much better place. I've learned how to manage it a lot better. The first two years were really tough. How do you do that? I got asked this the other day on the radio. One thing I did do was um when I got engaged, I made a promise to myself to like spend more time with him. We've been together for 10 years, and I kind of like neglected it for two of it with this business. And then I'm like, I gotta stop working weekends. So I hired someone to work weekends, a best friend who I could trust. And then he's like, You are not working a weekend. Like, he goes, I know that's my job, you don't work a weekend. Now he's away now, hence I'm working on this weekend. But um, I I think just that alone and putting a I guess a boundary in place and not being like, you have to do everything, and taking the sacrifice to hire someone, because you know, hiring someone costs money and hits into your margins. But it was probably the best thing I did. So stress is up there. Financially, didn't take an income for two years. So going from, you know, having a good income, owned a couple of properties, having to service those on no income for two years, and Amy paid for my whole life for two years, like everything other than rent. I worked at my local pub on Sundays to pay rent, and then I worked night shift construction for sort of six months. I do sober during the day, night shift construction management at night, and then get a couple of hours of sleep and do it again to bankroller business during winter. So financially, that was really tough. Just sacrificing everything from a financial perspective. And then friends and family, there has been the worst. Uh, you just because you work so many weekends, you just don't have time to see them. And during the week, you finish late and you're tired, and then you know, Amy comes first because I live with her and every every other reason. So friends, unfortunately, come last, and family that don't live close, unfortunately, it's even harder to see them. So, again, all things I'm putting a big uh focus on this year and in year three.
SPEAKER_00How important is it to have someone as special as Amy backing you through such an unknown period of time?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, pretty important. I actually wondered, like if I was single, let alone the dating aspect where you, you know, you go out for dinner and you gotta you know split the bill. Or as a male, I like to pay for things because it's just this in culture that I was or this mentality was embedded in my brain. My family was like, you always have to pay.
SPEAKER_00Um and now you're a sugar baby? No, okay.
SPEAKER_02Now I now I'm quite literally the opposite. It's so funny.
SPEAKER_00Um But it's not like you're a dropkick, you're actually trying to achieve it.
SPEAKER_02Thankfully, she believed me. If if like she didn't, I'd be pretty screwed. And because I worked so much before as well, I think I was very fortunate that she kind of knew what my we knew what I was like. We've been here for seven years at that stage. She knew what I was like and she really believed in the idea and she still does. Like there's still times where I don't really believe in what I'm building is gonna work, but she does. Um but if I did those two years no income single, like I actually would question how I would pay for dinner and a place to live. I'd probably go live back at home, which would be really tough to do. Um, because parents after a while can be annoying. Um but like food and stuff, I don't really know how I really don't know how I would have survived, to be fair. Like that sounds ridiculous, but I was very fortunate to live the life that I did for two years because of her.
SPEAKER_00What's one thing that she either said or did that made a massive impact in those two years?
SPEAKER_02Oh, I did was just like, don't worry, I'll pay for this. Don't worry, I'll pay for that. Like, even as little as like, let's go for a morning walk on the weekend, like buying a coffee for me. Just not to be able to just even buy a coffee. Like, that's how bad it is. Like, I did not couldn't even buy a coffee. I had to sell a house, which I really didn't want to do. Just little things like that. Like, but not even saying, Oh, buy it for she just does it. And she would pay for our dinner. We do Marley Spoon. So all those, and no questions asked, just like did it. And I'm sitting there just feeling guilty. And now I'm finally, you know, repaying the the debt, I suppose. But um, yeah, that's pretty tough. Very lucky.
SPEAKER_00So, do you guys live in a house or you've sold all of those and you rent now?
SPEAKER_02Uh, we live in a house, yeah. So I sold another property and we used that to buy a house we could live in together. Um and again, just thankful that I was, you know, coming out of school, I went straight into a you know a good industry and work. I did work very hard and I invested really young into a couple of properties. And thankfully, I invested in the right market in Queensland and it did well. Because I think if I didn't do that, like everything happens for a reason. Big believer in it. If I didn't do that, like we'd where would we be right now? I don't know. Because like she doesn't make enough money to fund both our lives for more than two years. So yeah. So that's getting a little bit emotional here thinking about this, yeah. Never really spoken about in this much detail.
SPEAKER_00I don't mean to pry, I just I genuinely am invested. I I think when you initially brought her up, I was like, to go through what you guys both went through, because it's not just you, it is her too, because she is holding everything together.
SPEAKER_02Gone through for two, now three years is is immense, immense. I had a ring that I just bought, which I saved up with over 18 months from cash from shows. Um, I had a ring and then she pulled me up, and she's not gonna like me saying this, but she pulled me up one day, first time ever, and said, I can't do this anymore. Because I was never home and I was always working weekends and late nights, and that was when I really had that like wow moment. Um, I need to make a change. But you know, this is a perfect podcast for it to be honest and I guess open and vulnerable because it's it's about you know people being delusional, I suppose. But this is quite literally the stuff that happens and people don't see that it's kind of funny to talk about it now, but it's it's not fun at the time, and it's still not fun really when you think back to it. And I wouldn't say, like, are we killing it now? No, like we are I pay myself complete minimum wage. Um, so it's just yeah, it's it's the stuff that you have to go through if you're trying to do what we're trying to do, and we're trying to take on the world, which doesn't help, but your whole story of what you're going through, I can relate, but in a different way.
SPEAKER_00My dad, he he was a Sparky by trade, so he came from the whole construction side of things, and then he ended up doing all these great fancy business ideas, but no strategy or way to really monetize them. And so they were fun businesses, and it's been we're coming up to our 20th year soon, and he the total sum were in like three million dollar debt, but for the last it took us 18 years to become an overnight success. And my mum was a nurse, so she just worked at the hospital and she paid the mortgage and she did everything to just keep things running. And only now that we have the bowling alley, first time in 18 years, he paid himself 500 bucks a week. And it's just like we haven't been. Rich, we've struggled a lot, but then to finally see it all pay off, it's like when you're going through the thick of it, you're like, there's no end in sight. Is this worth it? And I don't if my parents probably weren't Christian, I don't think they'd be together anymore because of like they're just stuck together because they want to be by themselves, but um, they don't want to be by themselves. Uh they want to support each other. And I think, yeah, what Amy has done to support you, is so special because so many people throw on the towel and give up, especially with business. It's like you are having the highest of highs and the lowest of lows, and you've got to try to hold all of that, be a good partner, be a good friend, be a good boss while you stress that.
SPEAKER_02There's only so much you can do as one person. I think I'm one thing that I did put in place, like a boundary, I suppose, is I didn't want her involved in the business at all from day one and still to this day, because I wanted that separation so that when we're together, we'd like talk about everything else that a couple would normally do and not talk about work. And if she asks me about work, I get upset because I'm like, I don't your our time together is our time together. Not we I talk about work enough because everyone wants to talk about work. And everyone thinks for the this is going into what you're talking about with your dad, like because you have a business, people think you're the richest person in the world and you have all this money. It's like, no, you are delusional. Like, no, that's not how it works. If anything, we're in a lot of debt, and I'm in a lot of debt, and I've got no money anymore because I gave away all my money to start this business.
SPEAKER_00Like, I believe one of the hardest things about being a business owner is when you're scaling, you're putting all your profit back into the growth of the business. And as soon as other people see you making money and they don't see all the costs that come with the business, they feel like they're entitled to a piece of it. You know, people they want equity, they want a pay raise, they want to get this promotion. It's like you have not had to work for it. You have not had to put everything on the line for you to just tragic, I I'm deserve 20% of this.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, exactly. Exactly. I think that made me think. So LinkedIn, right, which I'm pretty active on. The only way that I get I get some pretty good traction on it. The only thing that gets a lot of traction is when you're arrogant on it. And that's for everyone. So every time you do a post about your growth and everything, people go, holy shit, you are killing it. You're doing this, and you're like, mate, we lose money every year. We are not killing it by any means because we are investing every single dollar back into this thing to hit those numbers to grow and hit the end goal that we're trying to achieve. But again, it's things that people don't sort of see or understand. It's just part of it.
SPEAKER_00It's so interesting you say that about LinkedIn. Because on Instagram, when I've put up posts about my biggest struggles, almost going bankrupt, what that's looked like, I get the most engagement. It's so interesting that they're like different platforms with different perspectives.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, definitely, definitely. I that's we because now I'm like I'm trying to post everything on LinkedIn, which I'm sorry, on uh TikTok, which I can't stand. But you need to do it.
SPEAKER_00Your marketing girls, they can handle it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, well, so they do the business side, which we post every day, and then I'm trying to do my personal, which I just suck at editing and I don't have the time to sit down and record. And so anyway, um, we could talk about it as a separate thing. Um that when you're vulnerable and you tell true stories and it's about like it's founder-led content, it makes a big difference and it really works. Like our engagement levels spike. We just tested on Instagram. We're like, no, we need to focus on being a big brand, professional stuff, professional videos, professional photos. Engagement died, followers dropped. As soon as I got behind the camera and kept it in like a sort of relaxed style on the couch, bang, engagement sparked again. And I'm telling stories about this sort of stuff we're talking about, you know, with Qantas and whatever it might be. It's it's interesting.
SPEAKER_00I don't relate to any of the big corporate brands. They don't have that human element or that level of connection. It's all super polished. And I think now the way that we get market to changes. Like I've just started doing a reality TV show of our business, and it's crazy. Like, I haven't even posted the video yet. It's sitting there and I said, subscribe to the channel, boom, 200 subscribes overnight. Like it's just wild how much people want to see the behind the scenes versus when you put this really beautiful video that you've been working on, you paid five grand to the videographer, and you're like, why did this only get 100 views?
SPEAKER_02Yep, I know the feeling. I know the feeling. That's why, rudely, I'm not really I'm against so many agencies these days, because I'm like, they it's the stuff they want to do, but it's you need to hire in-house. Yeah, which we do, we only hire in-house. But it's like it's it's us, it's our team, and we treat now our content on TikTok and Instagram, because we finally have some staff, as like a TV show, kind of like a reality TV show. Like Jack's with certain character, he's the guy that's on leave at the moment, he's the one that runs all the shows and he's got his own personality, which is hilarious. And there's Sophia, the social media girl who's bubbly, funny, she's like the girly that all the girls relate to. And then there's I'm, you know, obviously, like the business owners and stuff that relate to me. So it's funny how it all works. It's actually a lot of fun though.
SPEAKER_00I think people are over trying to get the perfect camera graphic together. Like just they want entertainment if you can add the product in there in a non-salesy way. People prefer that. I love watching your content. I was actually watching how you got stocked in business class and first class.
SPEAKER_02Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_00How did that all come about?
SPEAKER_02So actually, before we get to that, I'm staying in a hotel here on purpose because the first ever time I came to no, the two years ago when I came to Perth, it was the first flight out to Italy that our cam was going on. And I'm standing in the lobby with my t-shirt on, Sobevy t-shirt, and the Qantas crew walk in and they go, Are you like you do you wait for the business? Um, and I'm like, No, it's actually my business. Why is that? And they go, mate, we just served it on the plane for the first time and it flew. It sold out in seconds. And so I stay at that hotel every time now because it's just so like emotion, nostalgic, that's the word. And I'm actually, I checked in today and I'm like, hey, what time did Qantas guys get here? They're like 10:30 and 5:30. I'm like, cool, I'll be there at 5.30 to wait in the lobby to see if I can talk to them. Because you just get the feedback from them on board. But that was an amazing story. That was um probably like a month after we launched, I can't remember now. The New York Jets reached out. Do you know who they are? No, they're a massive NFL team in the States. So a guy from the New York Jets reached out saying he loved our brand. We really wants to chat. And I was like, Well, this is obviously just spam or like fake. But took every opportunity, went back and forth. I was actually in Poland um drunk one night with my best friends. My solemn partner, Darcy, my best mate, he was in Australia at work and they were in New York, and we jumped on this meeting. And so I got drunk as I just didn't think it was actually gonna come to fruition. And I'm sitting there in the snow in a t-shirt doing this meeting with the New York Jets, and um, you know, they're like, come to come to the States, we really want to bring this product over. And I was like, oh if you pay for my flights, I will. Yeah, well, that was my thought, but they didn't do that. So I uh I was like, Yeah, you know what, we don't have the money, we just started, nothing's gonna come from it. Like, it just didn't make any sense. But then I was sitting down and like had a million quantus points, and I was like, you know what, I've got points, I've never been to America. It'd be a great story, and like what's the worst worst that's gonna happen? I'll go for four days, it'll be an experience. So Darcy and I went over and we're sitting uh on the plane, we upgraded ourselves to business with points, and um went over four days and we're sitting like the top cabin doing some work, the deck, and the Qantas cabin crew came over and like talking to us. And why are you guys flying? And we got talking for ages, and I don't like jinxing things, so I don't usually tell people ahead of time. But I was excited and I did. And um, he goes, Oh, send me an email like just about it, it's really interesting. Send me an intro an email about the product. Three months later, I get an email from Neil Perry Consulting, which was the guys that do all the catering for Qantas, and he's like, mate, we've heard about your product. Can you please uh submit some samples? So I was like, Okay. And I knew that it came from the cabin crew guy. So I jumped on the plane rather than sending samples and carried them to the door myself. And I'm like, I called him, like, hey man, I'm downstairs. He goes, We're not allowed to see supplies. I'm like, I've just flown here from Melbourne. Can you please um just come down and like let's grab a coffee? He goes, Oh, okay. So he came downstairs, had had a coffee, got talking, went through the whole process after that, and then six months later I got a call saying we're putting you in select flights around the world to Europe and then got Locure into first class and then went to business class not long after that. So that was a long story, sorry. But it's uh it's honestly one of the best stories of my life.
SPEAKER_00I think you just saying that, like you had to be delusional to think, hey, I'm gonna get on this and I'm gonna rock up here and I'm not leaving until you come down and we chat.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I kind of felt a little bit bad about that. But it's funny, we actually became, I wouldn't say friends, but you know, we developed more than just a relationship as we become sort of friends in a way, um, because of things like that, I suppose, seeing people face to face, especially in a world now when everything's like by Teams or Google Meet, which I hate doing. I'd rather meet you in person and you just develop a quite, I guess, a better connection.
SPEAKER_00You as a founder, your skills, you're a people's person, I can already tell. Like when I met you, you're super friendly, approachable, you've got a great brand. It's very inviting as well. What's your superpower?
SPEAKER_02That's probably why.
SPEAKER_00What is your superpower as a founder? Like, what do you think makes you the type of person that other people want to jump on this crazy bandwagon follow you with?
SPEAKER_02That's a tough question because I feel as though you need to pump yourself up here.
SPEAKER_00Um yeah, the imposter syndrome kicks in you, like, I'm not that good.
SPEAKER_02I just started this little brand. Kind of. And we've we spoke about this prior. Like, I try to be as humble as I can because I still don't think we've achieved enough or much, but a lot of other people do. I think I love like yeah, creating relationships that go beyond just a pure business relationship. So, like Quantus. So I went out, you know, the guy that I met on board, we have actually become like close friends. The guy at Quantus, we've we have like a friendship in a way. Dan Murphy's a buyers manager, so we have a friendship. Like it's not just, hey, we're here to do business and that's it. Like, I pride myself on my relationships and just in general, I'm a very social person. I like to actually talk to people and you know, ask if they have kids and learn about their families, that sort of stuff. I think that's probably my number one asset because I genuinely do care and I'm not doing it just to sell the whole time. So when I'm selling, I'm not just selling, I'm actually like I genuinely care about the person as well. So I think that probably does us a bit of justice and helps us with our you know major customers anyway.
SPEAKER_00Are you impressed with how many details I remembered coming into this podcast?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I yeah, did because I actually forgot about this podcast until this morning. So the fact that you remember it all day is pretty impressive.
SPEAKER_00I think it does make a huge difference. Like when people see that you have an attention of detail or a genuine interest, people don't care about you until they know how much you care about them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you can you can I think you can see through it too. If you know if someone's coming just to like win your business because it's you know their job or they want the money, whatever, like you can see through that. So, you know, I actually care about you, so I care about what you're trying to do in your life and everything like that. I'm not here just for this podcast. It's a true story. I messaged you, and then I met found out that you wrote it, I wrote your message, or one of the team did anyway, and you didn't respond to us. So I went through all our history because I actually cared.
SPEAKER_00Oh, very nice.
SPEAKER_02But then you didn't care enough to respond to us.
SPEAKER_00Hey, it was in my message requests.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that old chestnut.
SPEAKER_00You need to get a better system. You need a comment on the post because when they comment on the post, you go check them out and then you go check the messages. That's what I do. So I leave a comment on their posts and also send a message at the same time.
SPEAKER_02It's just too many things to stand on top of. It's too.
SPEAKER_00I've got two. Okay. Well, not personal assistance, I have jobs.
SPEAKER_02I I don't think I could do a personal assistant. I feel too bad.
SPEAKER_00I have a genuine question about like you didn't take a wage for two years and you were still hiring people. Yeah. Not being able to pay yourself and knowing that you're putting money towards other people, you're making all those sacrifices. What are the most important traits that you look for in someone that you're bringing into your startup?
SPEAKER_02That's pretty simple. It's hard work and work ethic. It's those two things. We've had, you know, interns that come work for us for free, but it's part of the uni course, and I can see straight through them already. Um, we've gone through four or five. With all due respect to them, they were they were no good because they just didn't have any work ethic, and it's getting harder to find you know younger people with work ethic.
SPEAKER_00Are they Gen Z?
SPEAKER_02Yep. Um, in this regard. Um, one though, stood out. Like you could tell it just any interview that she cared, she had work ethic, she wanted to learn and she wanted to go on above to better herself. So she got offered anyhow. She did her time, she ended up being a full-time employee. Number three, she's still with us today. She's our social media girl Sophia, she's the girly.
SPEAKER_00The girly. I love that it's like Sophia, the social media, like it just has a ring to it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it does. And she's, you know what, we get so many compliments about it, and I personally love her. She's amazing. She sits next to me every day and just puts a smile on my face because she's just so bubbly. She's really happy because Argentina won today. Um, and she's Argentinian. But yeah, I'd just, it's hard work and work ethic. If I sense that they don't really care enough, then we're like, well, you can just tell because then they'll leave after a couple of months, or they'll want more money, or they won't actually care to better themselves, they're going to come and do their job and that's it. And that's if they do their job. So yeah, everyone that works for us genuinely like cares and treats this brand like it's their own.
SPEAKER_00So because you're a startup and you're putting everything on the line, do you look for people who have a skill set that you don't have? So that it's like complementing the business, or are you finding people who have the right attitude and then you're trading them up?
SPEAKER_02Good question. I usually look for the obviously I'm trying to hire someone that in a field that is that I'm not good at and they're better at. So I guess that is number one. But two, they have to have work ethic and then I can join up with everything else. So Sophia, she actually never had a job before, other than like Iron Williams in terms of the career she wanted to embark on. Um, so I trained her up and I actually hired an agency to train her, basically, because I knew that her work ethic would allow her to get really good at what she does, and she's fantastic now. Um head of sales was a gun, she had an amazing experience, but she's like a bull at a gate. She's just like works almost probably more than me. Like her mum just passed away and she's still sending me emails for work. Like, she's a machine. So I look for both.
SPEAKER_00I think that's good advice. When you look at the cash flow side of things in your business, it's basically like doing a fit out if you think about it. Like when we did our fit out, you know, it's well, we initially thought it was gonna be 600 grand, it blew up to $1.7 million. But it's over after the $1.7. Yeah, I know. Yeah, there's a whole, yeah, don't even worry. But I guess what I'm trying to say is we paid that money, there's our fit out, like you buy a fridge, you buy a couple other things, and you can do it up, but you're doing full production runs. How did you manage the cash flow side of things?
SPEAKER_02And this is what I was sort of getting back to before. I like I didn't know what I was getting myself into, so I didn't really think that far through. Um, so I just I learned, I guess, the hard way. Um, and when like I have like yesterday, that guy that wanted advice, and I have a lot of sort of younger guys asking for advice and girls. Um, I've got this, you know, vodka sell to brand, whatever it might be. How do you do what you do? And I basically like give it to him straight. I'm like, the cash flow cycle is so ridiculously hard. So you have to have a lot of money, like whether you raise it or you have your own, whatever. Just think it through because you produce, like, we'll go spend 100 grand on production, we'll then sell it, and you don't just sell 100 grand worth of stock like that. I wish. Some brands do, most don't. So you have to sell it. So you'd you know, you drip feed stock out to them, Dan's, coals, whatever it might be. As soon as it leaves your warehouse, you pay the tax, which is hefty, huge. The taxes for our cans is double the price of what it makes uh cost to make a can, and our bottle is three times the amount than it costs to make a bottle. It's ridiculous.
SPEAKER_00And they have biannual tax increases every six months, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so you pay all the tax, and then obviously you have staff, you're paying staff. Then you know, you once you sell it, it's 30 to 60 days you get paid. So you're just in this constant negative until you get this injection of cash, and then you obviously never want to run out of stock, so you've got to produce before you run out. So the cash flow cycle is is horrendous in this industry. Um, but you just have to manage it. Like, unfortunately, if people don't pay you, you can't pay other people, and you have to be that asshole essentially that doesn't pay someone, which is probably the biggest thing I hate in business, is that when people don't pay you, because then you can't pay someone else, and that you don't know the effect that's gonna have on that person. Like, if they're a small business like a full mum and dad shop, that they might not be able to pay their rent this week. You don't know. So, um, yeah, I kind of got on a tangent there.
SPEAKER_00But no, I hear everything you're saying. When we were doing our fit out, we had no money and we were getting loans to just service the loans. It was really dark time. But one thing that we got told as advice was when you have these small businesses, don't just go pay the 20k invoice. You give everyone a little piece and just keep that going until you get through that period. Don't just blow all your cash into one business because it is the small players, the word of mouth travels and they will get traumatized and impacted the most because they don't have that buffer like big corps do.
SPEAKER_02I think we just gotta be selective on how you spend your money too. Like, you know, I've had a lot of brands or brand owners that have raised money from the start or have come from a pretty wealthy family and have a big chunk of money there, so they essentially think they're invincible and then will go spend the money like, yeah, you know, it costs 18 grand from this agency to do this. I don't know how to do it, so yep, let's use them. Then they blow their money, like an old company that raised $8 million, and they blew it all in like a year and a half because they just went 15 grand there, 20 grand there, and now they're out of money. So, but if you use your own money, I this is my personal opinion, like we did. I'm like, I'm not giving my money away to no one, like I hold it like it's my own because it is my own. I worked hard for it. So you're forced to learn and do things yourself. Like I built the website ourselves, did all the social media for the first year and a half on myself. Little things like that. So now I know how it all works, which is another asset in itself, because you, as a business owner, need it needs to know how your business works in every little facet.
SPEAKER_00This is a bit off topic and probably a little bit political, but I personally think if the people who ran the country in terms of government owned their own businesses and they knew the challenges and they actually had to make the money and then allocate it, it would be such a different kind of world we'd live in because you had to make that money. Now you've got to keep it, you've got to invest it, you've got to understand what's going to be the best case scenario and the worst case scenario. But when it comes to just getting given money, whether that's a government, whether that's you just getting investors on board, if you don't have a plan for where you're gonna put it, that's when things can go to shape.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's a that is a separate topic, and I could talk about that for a very long time, especially in the current circumstances. But uh we should probably should we probably shouldn't.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, definitely don't.
SPEAKER_02Or get too heated.
SPEAKER_00So with Solbevi, what is the plan? What is the strategy? Because you're not some small business anymore. You know, when you look at your local winery and they find all the restaurants and the bars and they're supplying out, you've scaled internationally. Like, how the hell do you continue to stay in this ever-evolving beast? Or how do you plan to exit without getting burnt?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's a um it's a scary thought, I think. We've uh we've grown pretty quick because I wanted to, and I still want to take it around the world. Like, that's my aspiration is to take it around the world and for it to sit next to Upright and Kampara to be very new around the world. That's our vision. Um, but it as we do it and as we grow and as we get into more countries and I'm in more places and more things to juggle, it's it's kind of getting a little bit scary, to be honest. But uh the adrenaline helps you get through that. The plan, the plan is to do exactly that. It's to you know do really well here because it's our home country. Unfortunately, it's getting a lot tougher in this country to to run a business like this, like I said, the taxes and the political stuff. Yeah. But it's take it around the world and prove the concept in as many countries as I possibly can until hopefully our dream buyer being Campari comes knocking at our door and says, Hey, we don't have a Lomoncello. It does sit perfectly next to Avril and Campari to run your business. So we we we the way I run the business and the way I've built it is to be very scalable in terms of our how we make our products now. Uh and then if we've got our gross models up really, really high, so that our model is really good. So if we drop it into one network like that where they have the marketing, the funding, the suppliers, all that sort of stuff, and we drop it into their business, we're actually a really beneficial and profitable business for them. So the dream was to keep it, but it's just not possible. It's honestly just too hard. It talks about cash flow, and that's that's to be honest, that's the biggest thing.
SPEAKER_00I know some people find a way to make it work, but realistically, if you are Italian and you have those strong traditional family values, it's not like you're gonna be that type of person that would be around if you continued to live in that vicious cycle.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, exactly. And that's why I tell like a lot of these young kids, just please be prepared. Because I wasn't, like, I was so naive. Best thing that ever happened that I was naive, but it's hard, and I don't see how you can continue doing this, and this sounds very negative, but I don't see how you can continue doing this for the rest of your life. Like it's just it is really, really hard. If we scale back and become like a yeah, a little winery that serves local or distillery, 100% profitable, good, but even like them at the moment, when drinking is declining, it's becoming really challenging for them. So yeah, that's why our strategy Australia just has always been to go big, but now it's like go bigger.
SPEAKER_00I know someone who did go through that process. They did the Armagnac. So, Francois, he's the guy that owns Grey Goose. One of these big coaches I know, he got introduced to him and then they ended up becoming friends. And don't quote me on this with like all the names and stuff, but you know how they have the reserves and How many people they can control who he owned, like 80% of them. And so he could control all the manufacturing. And he said, I've got this idea to do Armagnac. The brand that owns all the companies. I can't remember which one, but they have like Louis Vuitton and all of those.
SPEAKER_02Delvia Mage.
SPEAKER_00Yes. They offered to buy them out for, I think it was like 20 million or something like that. And they were like, no. And that was in the first year. So they could see the threat. And now this drink has gone on to win awards. It's been a crowd favourite and it just keeps scaling. And so you can see that these big companies, if they see someone smaller who's successful, they're like, let me buy it and acquire it, or like, let me buy it and crush it.
SPEAKER_02Exactly. And a lot of people, it's crazy that yeah, some of those companies buy them if they're like a competing product and crush them. Yeah. Because they're a threat. But then equally, like the benefit to them if it goes on the shoes on the opposite foot. We we do all the hard work, we build the product, we build the brand, and then they just go, Yeah, thank you. We'd take it off, drop it in our model, and we've got all the money in the world. We can blow it up and really like make it extremely profitable and all that sort of stuff. So my dream, like I said, is to see it sitting in every venue around the world next to Aperland Campari. I can't do that by myself. I just can't. So they can. So let them do it. Because that's my that's my end goal, that's my end vision. It's like the owner of Ross, the owner of Ross, Ross, the owner of Stone and Wood, one of the founders, I asked him, like, why do you sell it? Besides a huge, it was like 350 million, which was an amazing price tag. He's like, Steph, I want to be on every single store, every single tap, like we can only take it so far into the day. The company that bought it, can't reverse it, line, I think, they um they can achieve that. And they've they're doing a very good job at that at the moment. So that's how I'm gonna achieve my vision and my goal. Because I'm not doing this for the money. I'm really not. Otherwise, I would have stayed in construction. I'm doing this for the passion and all that sort of stuff. Which might sound false, but it's true.
SPEAKER_00I think as well, like you're taking risks and you're bringing people on that journey, and it's as much as it's had its downs, there's definitely also some cool things that you've had to overcome to become the person you are today. I never really got exposed to the whole world of alcohol until I got our liquor license for Wild West Bowling, and the amount of red tape that we had to go through was insane. But then following on from that, it just feels like alcohol is the hardest industry to be in. And we were, as you know, a venue, we were blindsided. We didn't know any better. So we got signed on to this contract to get our taps.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, of course it is.
SPEAKER_00Five taps. We didn't have the money. We were like, yep, these taps are worth 15 grand. We'll sign up. They got installed. We could buy those taps times 10 outright right now if we wanted to. Now that we're finally on our feet, but at the time we weren't. We have to put in at least $250,000 before we're able to get out of that contract. And you're locked in, and it just feels like why?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and that's what makes it hard for smaller brands like ours to compete because the big brands have so much power and money.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and how are you meant to go? Hey, come into the venue and like, oh, sorry, you're not allowed to stock anyone else. Like, we are with shweps, so we can't have Coke, we can't have Sprite. So people come in, it's like, oh, so I really want Pepsi Max or Solo, and they're like, okay.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's tough, but unfortunately, that's just all part of the game. And that's why they are the big guys. So the longer that we don't have to battle them for, the better. But at the moment, we're very fortunate that the Limoncello was not a contracted category, it's becoming one because it's blowing up so much. Yeah. But that's kind of how we scaled so quickly and got so many venues so quickly.
SPEAKER_00I don't know you, like as you know, I haven't known you for 10 years, but I can tell you've got a very hungry appetite for success and you want to be the best at what you do. How do you actually know when you've reached success? Because I honestly feel like when you're a founder, you're always hitting the next milestone, the next achievement. You never stop to slow down and actually feel like, wow, what I've achieved has been good.
SPEAKER_02What are you gonna do when you know, hey, I've made it I actually I actually don't think I'll hit that point, which is sad to say. If we sold a business for an amazing, you know, valuation, I would definitely feel relieved and happy and proud of myself. But I'd go straight away to doing something else. I don't think I would ever be fulfilled, I suppose, which is kind of sad now that I think about it. But yeah, I don't know. I always want more and always want to be better and I always want to do more, and I want to, yeah, don't I? Don't I just want to keep doing good things. Try my best.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02That's all I can do.
SPEAKER_00In terms of Campari, how the hell do you get in front of them? Do you just start popping up globally like you're saying that's the thing?
SPEAKER_02Oh the managing well, he's ex now, but the managing director at the time of Campari for Australia, New Zealand now sits on my board. Um, he saw me on LinkedIn. He reached out to me saying, I just want to say congratulations and how amazing it is to see what you're doing and your vision, love it. Uh, once he quit, I was like, hey, want to come help us? And he did. Oh, is this your fractional CFO? No, this is our he's on it, no, he's on our a board. Okay. Um we have a uh a like an advisory board. Okay. Um and he's on that. So they know us through that. We then took one of their sales, big sales reps as well. But it's just make as much noise as you possible, as you possibly can. That's all we all you can do. They'll find out about us eventually. They already do know about us, but we just need to be attractive for them.
SPEAKER_00Just so I'm aware, which countries are you currently stopped in and which ones are you wanting to add to your hit list?
SPEAKER_02We're Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Malaysia. We have Thailand and Philippines starting later this year. Um where after that? Hong Kong. I had a deal signed in Hong Kong a couple of weeks ago and it fell through, which I'm really upset about. Um, Southeast Asia is a big focus because we're a very seasonal business. We're in winter right now. It is the toughest time in the world. It's so hard because you know, all your variable costs, like your marketing and stuff, you wipe them all out because you have fixed overheads like staff and rent and stuff like that. You have to pay that. So we're we're so seasonal. Winter sucks. Sales drop like a 15th, one fifteenth. It's crazy. So where's it always hot? And you don't combat seasonality? Southeast Asia. And they love to drink, and it's always hot, and there's heaps of tourists, and lemon is quite refreshing, and you know, they have really like high profile flavoured foods and spicy foods. And what's a palate cleanser? Lemon cello, just ticks all the boxes, so grow in Southeast Asia and Asia in general, and then like the dream is to obviously take it to the US because that's where dreams are made of, apparently. And uh I've been there a couple of times with the New York Jets, and to be honest, uh it is like gee, if you can crack that market, it's insane what it can do.
SPEAKER_00Did you meet any of the other vendors at the expo? Yeah. Did you meet the guy that does the pizza bases?
SPEAKER_02Oh, there's how many there's heaps of pizza base guys.
SPEAKER_00Ricardo, that was his name.
SPEAKER_02I didn't actually meet them, but I saw them.
SPEAKER_00So he was 24 when he started his business. He's now 34. He is producing, from memory, he said about half a million pizza bases a week. And so he has 30 staff in Sydney and he has 60 staff in China. And he has scaled it so his pizza bases are basically everywhere in Southeast Asia. That's who you need to talk to.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, please. Do you know him?
SPEAKER_00I know the guys that I was hanging out with are friends with him. So yeah, I would love to have an introduction. Definitely get you in contact. But his story is insane. You know, he managed to take his Italian recipe and then turn it into this, okay. Now we're doing a bigger production and it's everywhere. So their main competitor at the expo was Latisa, and that's who we use for our pizza bases. I was like, I need to try your one.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, yeah. Competition. That's impressive. I I mean, I've go to Asia twice a year, do market visits. And just when you see the scale of things over there and the amount of people, and like I went to China as well, and that was next level. It just shows you how much opportunity there is. And that's probably the most exciting thing. Like, sometimes I'm down at the dumps and I'm like, you know, we're gonna fail, we're gonna this, we're gonna that. There's just not enough, there's too much competition here. And you go, like, then I go to Asia and I'm like, there is not much competition here, and the market is like insanely big. There is so much opportunity for everyone to play in.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_02And that's my positive, that's where I stay positive. I'm like, yeah, it's it's tough, but if you know, if someone's not in that venue, so I'll just go for that one. You can't preach to the choir in your hometown. No, no. And we've done a good job here, but there's a lot of competition. But in Asia, like, you know, what are we, 20 million people, and then it's crazy. Singapore's but oh, a lot of people in a small city, and then like China's obviously a billion, like it's crazy.
SPEAKER_00Do you just need to get in Bali? Actually, funnily enough, when I was at Snow Machine in Japan.
SPEAKER_02Uh in New Zealand, yep.
SPEAKER_00Well, you know, same vibe, it was just different. We saw those Sentauri lemon drinks, and they just come out and they sold out everywhere. And then coming back to Australia after Snow Machine sold out everywhere. It just takes one good placement at the right event to then become that viral brand.
SPEAKER_02And that's what we're trying to do. We're trying to get into more and more events because that's a fantastic form of marketing. The only issue is it's pay-to-play. Like, I've been to an event where we're gonna sponsor, and the price tag was $150,000 for a four-day event.
SPEAKER_00To just supply, you have to also pay.
SPEAKER_02And then they buy the product off you, but they can assure you to not buy $150,000 worth of Lomacola spritz cans. But it's marketing play. There's a massive festival group, they're amazing, they used to be friends of mine, they're huge, they've done amazing things.
SPEAKER_00Untitled?
SPEAKER_02Yes. They this this is what blows my mind is that they uh have their own uh Vodka Seltzer brand that they sell in Lakeland, it does really well. But the biggest thing they sell at those events is Vodka and Vodka Red Balls and Vodka Seltzer's. Yet now they had it going for a while, now they get offered so much money from Smurnoff that it doesn't justify them selling their own product at their own shows, which is wild. So it's like, how do you compete? But we're trying to get any more events and festivals because it is it's great marketing.
SPEAKER_00Okay, let's backtrack because I know we've skipped over this. You were in the F1. How the heck did that happen? That is a cool event to be a part of.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's pretty cool. Not gonna lie.
SPEAKER_00Did you get to meet anyone?
SPEAKER_02No, no. Actually, they gave me four general admission passes. And you didn't use them? And I spent a lot of money with them. I made it back, but still, and I got four general admission passes.
SPEAKER_00You got a VIP. I wonder I like literally sometimes I'll be watching Kimmy Antonelli and I'll get teary. I don't usually get teary, but to see a young kid handle that much pressure and do so well, I think it's really inspiring.
SPEAKER_02That's amazing. Is he 18 years started? Yeah, in his Italian. Yeah, no, the Formula One was was amazing. It was another really, really cool experience, I suppose. It was kind of surreal seeing it there. Um how did you prep for that? Oh, it was a shit show. Because we moved our production to New Zealand uh like two months earlier, and then we got the final okay a month out. And I was like, I got no stock. It's coming from New Zealand, and they're like, Yeah, it'll be there in a month, so you know, you still have plenty of time. It didn't rock up in time. It kept getting delayed on the sea and production got delayed. And so I went to all my warehouses around the country and went to heaps of retailers and bought back our stock and then resold it to the F1. Um so we yeah, we saved it, thankfully, and we actually made money, thankfully. But yeah, it was the prep was not good.
SPEAKER_00So, how did you get all your stall and everything sorted? Do you have like a stock standard one that you take with?
SPEAKER_02We sold it into their bars. Okay. So we sold it into every single general admission bar.
SPEAKER_00Okay, so you didn't have to get like your own thing, not like Casa Ferrari.
SPEAKER_02I'd love to, yeah, I wish. Um, I actually just put our application in yesterday for for that, but it's just too competitive. And the price tag is like four times as much as what we paid. It's really hard. We had a very unique product, we're all Victorian. We're very fortunate. Like we didn't even get this year because the competition is just immense.
SPEAKER_00So, did you have to pay to be in this F1?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. Every event that you think of, you have to pay. And like a stadium, they buy your product, but you give massive rebates, you essentially break even. And you have to spend circa X amount of dollars on marketing.
SPEAKER_00What are your thoughts on influencers? Because I don't have much trust for them anymore.
SPEAKER_03That don't work.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And I like when I see an influencer, well, actually, I was one of those people that was an influencer in the past and I didn't align with it because I'm like, A, I'm not narcissistic enough to be like, look at me and my life and buy this product, and like, oh no, sorry, my auntie got it for me. I don't know. You know, it's just like so fake. But I think where I was going with this is you have these influencers who get everything for free. Yeah. And it's just like crazy the amount of money that these brands are paying to put on these events to bring these people together. LinkedIn's been part of your strategy from more of a corporate perspective.
SPEAKER_03B2B, yep.
SPEAKER_00And then you're not even focusing on Instagram more, it's like TikTok, right?
SPEAKER_02Because you want that virality or yeah, because we want to because all young kids, you know, even all ages really see. 18 plus. And do yeah, and Doom Scroll. Did I say teenagers?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you said young kids, and then I was like, let's just say 18 plus, because we are selling alcohol here.
SPEAKER_0218 plus, but all these young, every age group, Doom Scroll and TikTok. I personally don't, I can't stand it. But same. They doom scroll, and that's where they consume all their knowledge these days. Like, I heard for that from actual like kids and teenagers. Yeah, they don't Google. They don't Google, they use TikTok. How do you do this? I was like, what the hell is going on?
SPEAKER_00So different. I chat GPT now. I used to be like serial Googler, now I'm a chat GPT, and then I'll cross-check if it's statistics or like you know, if it needs to be fact-checked.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I see. That's a good thing it's a very different yeah. But no, we're trying to do more Instagram because we're just trying to leverage every pro every platform because you just need to be everywhere, which is really hard and time consuming. But we're a consumer, like consumers buy our product. We sell it to you know businesses, but at the end of the day, we need to target consumers because they're the ones that actually buy it from those businesses. So it's like just get on social media and pump it as hard as you can and doing as many events as you can.
SPEAKER_00I don't know if you can really track this or answer this, but would you say it's like a 50-50 split of people who buy it, like females and males, or is it more of girly dream?
SPEAKER_02No, no, we target the girlies on TikTok. And that's what I always have to say, apparently it's girlies.
SPEAKER_00But um because your marketing on Instagram, it's pretty girls, it's hot chicks. Is that to draw in guys or is that to make girls feel welcome?
SPEAKER_02Or people just related to it a lot better. We tested it out, um, and yeah, people just relate it to that content better. Um, funnily enough, we have a 50-50 split on consumer, which is really interesting. Males, although they look at them and chill spits like, oh that is that's girly, they drink it. Do I say this tastes better than hard-rated? I'm like, cool, drink it. And they do, they love it. They drink it all the time. I know heaps of guys that buy it. Well, obviously, I know them because my friends, but we got our stats from Dan's the other day, and we got heaps of fem um females and males that drink our product. What threw me was the demographic. Wow. I thought we were 25 to 35 year olds, and that's who we target. It was like it was 35 to 45.
SPEAKER_00Wow, okay.
SPEAKER_02For our lemon cello spritz can't.
SPEAKER_00I guess you are in first in business class, they've got to save up their pennies to get to that stage.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, true. But it it threw me. So now I'm like, do we change our marketing strategy? I don't know. I'm kind of rattled.
SPEAKER_00I was celebrating my new promotion with a lemon cello spritz. Yes, exactly.
SPEAKER_02But then 50 plus I find they they don't they refuse to drink from a can because they're too, you know, old for that.
SPEAKER_00Well, I'm in like a business where we're located in a country town, and what I found is quite interesting, we have a bunch of cans in our fridges, and you'll find the blokes always go for, you know, a Jack Daniels can or something if they're not getting a beer. But I said to mum and dad, can I just try getting some different drinks? So I put in the 196s.
SPEAKER_02Still waiting for my order, by the way.
SPEAKER_00If we I will. Uh if we have the 196s in there, we at the time when it was going viral and quite popular, it was all that like 18 to like 25. But next to the 196s, I put Smyrnoff double blacks. Bad idea because they're double blacks, people get drunk faster. But I found the people who went to go buy them, they all associated the I know what that drink is or I understand what I'm drinking. Whereas all these new things, they're a bit scared to like pay the money and not like it.
SPEAKER_02But that's been our biggest challenge, is that, and that's why we do all these consumer shows. We do like we're gonna do 32 this year, which is a lot. People don't know who we are, they look at hard-rated and they go, I know that brand, I know that product, I know that taste, uh, you know, I'm gonna spend $26, whatever it is. I know my money's safe doing that. Whereas they look at ours and they're like, oh, Limit Choice Spirits, that looks cool, sounds cool, but it's $24. I don't know if I'm gonna like it, so I'm not gonna get it. And people tell us that direct feedback at these shows. Like, I've seen that before, but I was just too scared to spend the money on it. They try it at the show and they're like, done, I love it. I now have the confidence to buy it. Especially when, like, you know, times are tough for a lot of people, they don't want to waste 24 bucks, which is totally understandable. So that's our biggest challenge as a business is how do we get more consumers trying it, getting them to try it to give them the confidence to buy it? So, how do you break down that barrier? And you know, free sampling at these shows, we we'll do like 6,000 samples over this next three days. That's 6,000 people that try their product, that hopefully like it, buy it, recommend it to someone else, and it flows on.
SPEAKER_00How do you make the decision of what's worth an investment for your brand versus not?
SPEAKER_02Um, I'm not very good at that. You go to the board? I try and do no. I try and do as much as I possibly can. That's my thing. Take every opportunity, do everything I can, which is probably why I burn myself out so much. Um, like these shows, we overdo it. But again, it's like You've got to be everywhere. You've got to do it. And sometimes we lose money. Like we did a show last week in Melbourne, in our own hometown, and we lost money in it. Like that's pretty hard to justify. And then everyone's like, oh, I did really well. I'm like, oh yeah, stop you. But it's just like gravity. Yeah, and then we do events and we're like, we will lose money on some, but then others will make money on. Like, if you don't try it, you don't know. And I have a bit more data now, so I know like coming to this Perth show is we probably break even because flights, accommodation, but it's a marketing for thing for us. We have heaps of stores here, heaps of stores here. So cool, try it. Go to your local Dan's do it, go to your local Luca Land and buy it. Done. Because they always go, where can I buy it? I'm like, yeah, right there. Don't go to my website, go to the store.
SPEAKER_00So, what do I need to do if I wanted to get Leoncello spritz? Is it more we buy it from Dan Mervi's and we put it in the venue? Yeah.
SPEAKER_02No, we've got we got heaps of wholesalers. So you can buy it through like Liquid Mix, ALM. Do you use those guys? We use CUB. Okay, then on a wholesaler.
SPEAKER_00Okay, who's this wholesaler? Dan does the ordering for stock. I find the drinks, but Dan, we have we do have a bar manager.
SPEAKER_02We buy it through like a wholesale, like a liquid mixer or ALM, who basically we know respectfully, they're box movers. So we go out, we sell the product to venues, and they go, cool, where can we buy it? So then they'll buy it from liquid mixer. So they can buy, you know, 15 different products in one invoice. So they're in Canningvale and they just stock our stuff, which is really hard to get into the wholesalers because then you need to move it for them. Otherwise, they just hold dead stock. So liquid mix ALM, otherwise, through our website or you email me directly. Or if people are feeling really nice and want to spend the money, in store. In store. You have a store. No, as in like Dan's and Lickoland. Because we have such strict KPIs to stay on the shelf. We've got 12, 1,300 stores, and we need to sell two four packs per store per week. You can do the math on how many that is. That's a lot of four packs.
SPEAKER_00So and how long do you okay? Let's say, for example, worst case scenario, you were in decline. How long have you got to like get those numbers back up before they're like, see ya?
SPEAKER_02We haven't been in that position yet. We're actually in decline at the moment because it's winter. So that's the other like conversation you have with them is like, you know, we're a seasonal product. Like we over-index in summer, we under under-index in winter. Likely they're not stupid and they get that, but it's it's hard. I don't actually know the time frame.
SPEAKER_00You're literally on the perfect podcast because I have like a lot of people who are females on it who love lemoncello. Like one of my friends Celine, whenever we go out, she's like, There's a lemon cello spritz margarita, and I'm getting that. You know, it's just everything is lemoncello. I feel like this is the right place.
SPEAKER_02Please go to Dan's, please go to Luke Lane and buy my product.
SPEAKER_00Can you get these next time we go out? We like when you mess up, I'm like, I never drink, but this year for a couple more.
SPEAKER_02We need people to drink more, not drink less. Responsibly.
SPEAKER_00Do you drink much?
SPEAKER_02Uh yes. I don't drink my own product.
SPEAKER_00Do you drink wine? What do you drink?
SPEAKER_02Red wine.
SPEAKER_00Okay.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And then I don't drink to like get drunk or anything like that. Well, because I love alcohol. I love the social setting of drinking.
SPEAKER_00And that's why I like. That's a cultural thing as well. With Italian, you share those moments.
SPEAKER_02I was having red wine when I was like 13. Yeah.
SPEAKER_0015.
SPEAKER_02With my family dipping bread in it. I was having lemon cello when I was probably younger. But I had like a lot of backlash on a post once, being like, alcohol's bad for you, you shouldn't drink it, you're the reason you there's issues with society. And I'm like, I don't drink or I don't have an alcohol brand or encourage people to drink to get drunk. I do it because it's the social setting of it. Like in Australia, unfortunately, or fortunately, in many countries, the culture is that you catch up with your friends or your family, like the old Italians sitting on the side of the road and have a little glass of wine and play cards. Like it's the social setting. People aren't necessarily doing it to drink to get blind. Yes, there are those people, and that's a problem. But my my most enjoyable thing in life is having an amazing like bottle of wine with great food with my closest and best friends. I love it. And so do many, many other people. It's socializing, it's how we stay connected.
SPEAKER_00Definitely.
SPEAKER_02I'm very passionate about it, as you can probably tell.
SPEAKER_00Well, I can see where you're coming from. It's so funny. We have this conversation, so my whole Tiniest side of the family. My mum is like allergic to alcohol and they don't drink. Whereas my dad, he loves to have his bearded lady. It's like he's got we've got our own um lager or beer. Yeah, Bruce Juice. So we just juice. We have our Facebook famous Brahmin Bull, he's got like 70,000 followers, and we had a brewer say, We'll do a beer, and you can call it Bruce Juice. So it's 6.8%. And yeah, it's like hits you harder, like a Brahmin bull or something like that. Than a Brahmin bull. Yeah. So we've got our own beer, and Dad loves that, and he sits and he will have one every night. And I think part of him is like undiagnosed ADHD, so it's the only thing that like chills him out and stops all the crazy ideas for a moment. But same thing. We did this whole fit out of a shed, and now we do like smoked meats. We have the whole crew there, we have a few drinks, but it's not like you're drinking to get drunk. When I was fresh 18, different story. You were like prees, party bus, club, you know?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, buy this buy the cheapest but the highest alcohol to get to your blind. Goon bags? Yes, goon bags, yes, for some. For some. We're actually about to do some goon bags, but with um lemon cello. I'm not gonna tell you what it is, but it's got lemoncello in it, it's pretty cool. And then we may potentially be doing some lemoncello margs in cans as well.
SPEAKER_00I think lemoncello margs is definitely something.
SPEAKER_02I comp those in venues so much.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02They're so popular. And two growth categories in a can. It's a no-brainer.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. So do you have any words of wisdom or pieces of advice that really helped you get through hard times that you'd want to pass on to another founder?
SPEAKER_02To get through hard times. My biggest advice for everyone is that tomorrow is a new day. So it might be the worst day of your life today. Go to bed, try sleep, but get up tomorrow because tomorrow's a new day, and then you can fix it. And you wake up and your your your whole mental attitude changes, your attitude in general just changes. So put it this way, you're lucky to be alive. So nothing gets worse than uh nothing, nothing can be nothing can be worse than that. So just get up, tomorrow's a new day, relax, start again.
SPEAKER_00And what's a skill, podcast, resource, something that you would recommend to anyone in business that's really helped you as well?
SPEAKER_02I listen to a lot of business podcasts. That's that's something that I really enjoy, and it has helped. It's just interesting to hear what other people have done. Like this sort of thing, I really enjoy doing because I think, and I would listen to something like this, obviously, because you hear it like roar about how it actually is. And then if you can get some tips and tricks, awesome. And it's you know, those little one percenters you can steal out of uh or nuggets of gold, as they say. That's that's what you look for, and if it all helps.
SPEAKER_00I feel like when you read a book, you're literally entering into someone's whole mind, their years of experience, you're getting like the best parts as well without having to live their whole life. Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_02I would love to read books, but I just don't have time. As bad as it sounds, but I listen to like podcasts instead and and occasionally what are they called? Um, audiobooks.
SPEAKER_00What do you do on your flights?
SPEAKER_02Work. I just from here that four hours and ten minute flight. I literally did not put the laptops down the whole time. Yeah, that's my perfect time to catch up because no one's annoying me, except quantitative internet, so people can still iMessage me. But um, that's where I get all my work, I get a lot of work done on flights, which is why I'm probably gonna go to bed after this for an hour and then go set up the show, go to a dinner, and then start selling tomorrow.
SPEAKER_00It's a new day.
SPEAKER_02It's a new day.
SPEAKER_00Thank you so much, Stefan, for coming in today. And straight off the end of a flight, I know you're tired, but I really appreciate all your words of wisdom and everything you've shared. Like I'm I'm in awe of what you've achieved. I don't think people in your position will ever truly recognize how successful you actually are, even when it feels like you're not. I can tell you, you may not feel like a millionaire, but you have become the person who is capable of making millions. And I think that is a really cool thing.
SPEAKER_02Thank you, and thank you for having me. This is actually, yeah, I've done a few of these, but this has actually been really enjoyable and the probably the most vulnerable vulnerability that I've been. So, um, like I said, almost got emotional in that, which is kind of concerning. But um, I'll toughen up next time.
SPEAKER_00Maybe, maybe that's what you need, like that side. I guess that person can bring out that side of you. Like having someone like Amy in your life, that's a special thing for you and her. But when you're in the business, you're in your like boss mode. Like, don't be boss mode all the time with your partner.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, maybe just in like one big afternoon of just crying and letting it all out. Just let it all out.
SPEAKER_00Trauma. I think every entrepreneur is shaped by trauma. Like, literally, that is it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, I find out if we've gone past it, but yes, uh, trauma, which is kind of where I am now for a reason.
SPEAKER_00So, if someone wants to follow along with your journey, keep up to date with Sol Bevy, buy some, where should they go?
SPEAKER_02So, if I can ask for any favourites to head into Danza Lickeland and try our four packs. Um, but we're on socials, Soulbevy underscore official on TikTok, Instagram, my full name, which is quite long for both accounts as well, and then LinkedIn. Um, they were pretty active on it. We post every day. So we love having people join our community and we really try and give back to the community. So um yeah, give us a follow.
SPEAKER_00Okay. Well, we'll bring Soul Bevy. I'll put you in my I'll bring Soul Bevi into the crew at bowling. We'll put you in keeping up with the Kennedys, our new TV show, and we'll get some eyeballs.
SPEAKER_02I like it. Thank you. Thank you.
SPEAKER_00Thank you so much for tuning in today's episode. If you found value and loved it, please take a screenshot, share it to your stories, and tag both of us. We'd love to hear your feedback. Thank you so much for listening to the podcast, and I'm
